Sonalysts Combat Simulations

[Crail]

Human player on Helicopters i do not play, nodoubt your right Luftwolf. I presumed you were talking in general about Helicopters.

As AI controlled helicopters it is the MK-50 (as printed in manual)not MK-54 as you point out for the Human Player.
This fact is interesting in it self as to why the game changes weapon load. Interesting because the DW game manual also backs me concerning the MK-50 which says that AI helicopters using MK-50 torpedos are only used against Surface shipping not submarines. I know i have tried only to see many torpedos go wandering past subs. May be this conflict of interest is some thing that was missed during the creation of DW.

[LuftWolf]

I've sank many many submarines with Mk50's so I'm not sure where you are getting that from. Also, the AI helo's definately use MK50's against submarines. This is controlled, internally by the game, by flags in the Database, and the MK50 is clearly flagged as an ASW weapon.

You can check this yourself by using Ludger's Database Editor and checking the database.

Can you point to me to the place in the manual about the Mk50's?

Also, the MK54 is introduced in the game as of the LWAMI mod, as a replacement for all American MK46's, as the torpedo is redundant for human controlled platforms.
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LW

[OneShot]

Well, the manual supports LWs position. Here is an excerpt from the Game manual, page 8-21. "The MK-46 and MK-50 are LWTs and as such are meant to target submarines. They are not frequently sent out on long-range searches or used against surface ships, but used to prosecute a known subsurface contact at short range."

From my personal experience with the Helo, I have to say those Torpedoes work wonderfully against Subs, especially the MK-50 (tho I'm talking bout DW 1.01 - no Mods). Just have to find and fix the sub properly first, if you do that, you wont miss (most of the times).
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[Crail]

HANG ON GUYS

First let me remind you of my original post Oneshot in reply to Luftwolfs statement in his MOD brief about helicopters using MK-54S.

This is what i said

"Tell me, since when has the MH-60 dropped MK-54 Torpedos? The two Birds i use, Drop MK-50's ! "

I said the Helicopters only used MK-50s. Luftwolf replied no they don't.

I was correcting the type of torps on load out for AI Contolled Helicopters on FFG. Luftwolf then replied that he used Human contolled Helicopters that used MK-54S. Though if you look at the manual 8-21 which oneshot kindly points out, I see i was right in the first place, they do only use MK-50S.


As for torpedo not hunting surface shipping fired from Helicopter, well my mistake on this point. It was in Fact the MK-48 not MK-50. Though the mistake is trivial as no one corrcted me on that mistake which would of been common knowledge if one used the AI Helicopters alot.


I said i would provide the evidence from the manual that the Helicopter was using MK-50S NOT MK-54s as Luftwolf said.



Here is the reference in the manual that back my comments:

MK 50 Torpedo or MK 48 ASW Torpedoes: The MK 50 can target subs and surface ships within range of the in-flight helicopter. The torpedo is set to circle search. The FFG’s AI driven helo also carries one MK 48 AWS torpedo that can only target submarines. When this option is selected the in-flight helo flies to and engages the selected target. The helicopter carries two MK 50 torpedoes and one MK 48 ASW torpedo when ASW is assigned as the loadout in HELO STATUS.

��Note: the only way to launch the FFG’s embarked helicopter’s missiles is with this command. Only the MK 48s carried by the AI driven helo are restricted to submarine targets. All other MK 48 Torpedoes can target surface ships as well as submarines. Hellfire missiles launched by player controlled MH-60s can target surface ships as well as land targets. Only the Hellfire’s on the AI driven helo are restricted to Strike only.


REF: section 7 FFG STATIONS 7-35



Sorry guys

[Crail]

Just adding Luftwolfs comment from his MOD brief AS looking over his comments i see he is getting confused.


"When playing as the FFG, you cannot order your AI controlled MH-60 to drop the Mk54 on a waypoint, only from the command on the Nav map. This is due to an interface issue hard-coded in the game, however, you can work around this by creating a manual solution where you want the torpedo dropped and order the torpedo dropped on that solution rather than the actual contact."

[LuftWolf]

I'm sorry, you've totally lost me.

But I can tell you, for sure, there is no aircraft in the world that drops Mk48s...

Also, I'm definately NOT confused about any point made in the readme for the mod or about gameplay issues in general. I'm sorry, but I'm just not.
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LW

[LuftWolf]

Maybe we can clear this up if you are talking about your experience with the UNMODDED game or with the LWAMI Mod?
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LW

[LuftWolf]

With the unmodded game, your the AI helo carries two Mk50 ASW/ASuW torpedos and one MK46 ASW (a torpedo with an unrealistic restriction against targeting surface ships, this doesn't exist in real life) torpedo. The MK54 DOES NOT EXIST in the unmodded game.

With the Mod, the AI helo still carries two MK50 ASW/ASuW torpedos and one Mk54 ASW/ASuW torpedo and the Mk46 ASW is completely removed from the game.

Does this clear things up?
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LW

[OneShot]

@Crail : Congrats, you found the hidden (actually not) typo in the manual. If you check the game you will notice that the AI Helo in the ASW configuration carries two Mk50 and one Mk46 (in the unmodded version) respectively one Mk54 (in the modded version) in the game. The manual mistakenly says its a Mk48, which is not only one real mother compared to the other torps but isnt even carried in the FFG stores for refill. For a comparisation in terms of size take a look at the P-3 OWTOP, there is a nice picture in it, with all those torps compared in size. As for comments on the Mod, I refer back to LWs post.

Cheers
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[LuftWolf]

Thanks OneShot, I was wondering about the Mk48 reference... that's what I get for not reading the manual.
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LW